PDA

View Full Version : Palm Pre - an iPhone challenger at last?



decryption
9th January 2009, 09:33 PM
http://heyinternet.com/imgdump/palm_pre-20090109-223004.jpg

Palm shocked everyone and actually released a product that's modern and something people want (http://www.palm.com/us/products/phones/pre/index.html). It borrows a lot from the iPhone, but is also innovative in it's own way. It's like the Palm of old.

Check out these videos Gizmodo has for all the UI interactions: Palm: Palm Pre Full Video Tours (http://i.gizmodo.com/5126752/palm-pre-full-video-tours)

I think the Palm Pre is fantastic - it forces Apple to innovate. I know I wouldn't buy a Palm Pre over an iPhone as I just love Apple products so much and I am so used to the Apple eco-system that everything is second nature, but I can tell many, MANY people will prefer the Palm Pre.

It's also very interesting to note that Palm has Jon Rubinstein (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Rubinstein) as their executive chairman of the board since October 2007. Previous to being at Palm, Jon was senior vice president of Apple's iPod division, as well as being a big part of the iMac's creation and development and the G4 and G5 range of PowerMacs.

Has being so close to our beloved Steve shown Jon a thing or two that he took to Palm and made them get off their arse and make some decent products again? Let's hope so. Apple needs a competitor and lord knows Microsoft & RIM aren't going to do it.

Also, someone at Palm likes Arrested Development:
http://heyinternet.com/imgdump/Palm.com___Shop___Pre-20090109-223910.jpg

kevinnugent
9th January 2009, 09:37 PM
How long does Sprint have the exclusive on this one Anthony?

I think you're right, and the fact that it doesn't have WM on it is a great move, in my opinion.

bennyling
9th January 2009, 09:43 PM
I think the Palm Pre is fantastic - it forces Apple to innovate. I know I wouldn't buy a Palm Pre over an iPhone as I just love Apple products so much and I am so used to the Apple eco-system that everything is second nature, but I can tell many, MANY people will prefer the Palm Pre.


You're damn straight it does. Multiple apps open at a time, excellent "cards" analogy for those apps, funky new menu system, system wide copy and paste, full-featured bluetooth, full integration with Facebook and GMail, IMs and Emails and SMSs flow into each other, USB Mass Storage, removable rechargeable battery (with WIRELESS recharging!!), seriously, it's like everything the iPhone was supposed to be - but wasn't.


Has being so close to our beloved Steve shown Jon a thing or two that he took to Palm and made them get off their arse and make some decent products again? Let's hope so. Apple needs a competitor and lord knows Microsoft & RIM aren't going to do it.

So my question is - where does this leave Android? We all thought that Android was going to be "the next big thing", but nope - the G1, while different, couldn't be called "innovative" by any stretch of the imagination, and so we're left with an awkard Apple vs Palm standoff...

Thing is, as it stands - the iPhone is definitely behind (both in terms of software and hardware), but will the Palm Pre be the first true "iPhone Killer"?

EDIT: Watch the Ars video:
Ars Technica first hands-on with the Palm pré phone on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/2766236)

boddiz
9th January 2009, 09:43 PM
sprint has the CDMA version exclusive.

Palm is bring out a 3G/GSM version for "other areas" at the same time :)


am so getting one =))

decryption
9th January 2009, 09:45 PM
am so getting one =))

Do you have an iPhone already? If not, why are you getting a Pre over the iPhone? (remember, it won't be out until mid-09 at the earliest and Apple will have iPhone firmware v3.0)

Tom125
9th January 2009, 09:47 PM
Looks interesting. You're right, it will be good for Apple to have some innovative competition.

My very first PDA was a Handspring Visor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handspring_(company)#Visor_and_Visor_Deluxe) which was running PalmOS. Fantastic for what it was at the time!

bennyling
9th January 2009, 09:48 PM
Do you have an iPhone already? If not, why are you getting a Pre over the iPhone? (remember, it won't be out until mid-09 at the earliest and Apple will have iPhone firmware v3.0)

iPhone firmware 3.0 won't fix hardware issues, of which the iPhone has many (compared to the Pre, anyway). :p

Rogerthatv2
9th January 2009, 09:51 PM
Been a massive fan of Palm from way back and owning more Treo's than I care to remember I think that this is great. This so far has been the only phone released since the iPhone that I have thought that I would not mind getting, appears to have a great UI, full keyboard and that screen looks incredible.

The iPhone still is a winner for me though, love the iPod / Phone in one unit, the Apps as well as how easily it syncs with my Mac.

Good to see Palm fighting back but.

kyte
9th January 2009, 09:52 PM
Nice. This could tempt me not to upgrade my iphone.

boddiz
9th January 2009, 09:54 PM
Do you have an iPhone already? If not, why are you getting a Pre over the iPhone? (remember, it won't be out until mid-09 at the earliest and Apple will have iPhone firmware v3.0)


I do :) (2G, 8gb)

frankly, I am over the iphone.

I have an ipod touch, and although im an avid mac user, little things like copy and paste, proper push, ability to run multiple apps, etc annoy me.

Also, so many people have one, they have lost all originality.

I also dont like how apple has total control over what you can put on your phone (unless you jailbreak, but im thinking about out of the box.

The palm has brought something new to the board. The interface in nice and clean, like apples. However, apples is "basic" and simple, whilst the palms is neat and simple. Did I mention everyone and there dog has an iPhone?

Obviously I would wait until 3.0, but unless it fies everything and most, I will be sticking with the palm.


:|

decryption
9th January 2009, 09:55 PM
Did I mention everyone and there dog has an iPhone?

Why is that important to you? (not critiquing here, just wanting to know)

boddiz
9th January 2009, 09:56 PM
its nice to see apple fanboys appreciate an iphone competitor, instead of trying to burn it down like on engadget/gizmodo :p


Why is that important to you? (not critiquing here, just wanting to know)

Im one of those people that want to stand out.

I first bought an original iPhone because they weren't available here, and i wanted something different. Same goes for my clothing style, haircut, music style, etc.

Then again, im a teenager, s thats normal, isn't it? ahahah

haydio
9th January 2009, 10:00 PM
A challenger appears

decryption
9th January 2009, 10:03 PM
A challenger appears

It's the eye of the tiger, it's the cream of the fight, risin' up to the challenge of our rival.


http://heyinternet.com/imgdump/06collection-20090109-230149.jpg

boddiz
9th January 2009, 10:08 PM
It's the eye of the tiger, it's the cream of the fight, risin' up to the challenge of our rival.


http://heyinternet.com/imgdump/06collection-20090109-230149.jpg

I can play that song on expert on guitar hero :)

wmyeoh
9th January 2009, 10:51 PM
While I have to say that the Palm Pre looks like the most challenging competitor to the iPhone so far, it is way too early to tell if it will compete at all. I'm really glad that Palm has finally realised something innovative, and it's clear that this product is heavily influenced by the iPhone in that it has so many things the iPhone lacks.

For those people but want the iPhone's UI, but also want a physical keyboard, that are sick of all the software limitations that the iPhone have - for example, inability to run multiple apps at once (what happened to background notifications we were promised months and months ago?), this seems like a really solid choice.

But we don't have a solid release date, we don't have a price, and we haven't seen someone have an extended play with it. We only have to go back to the Blackberry Storm to see how a product with a heap of potential can quickly become a heap of steaming turd.

If, as it seems likely, the phone will debut in June some time, Apple still has plenty of time to get their ass into gear and start adding in some of the features that should have come with the iPhone back in July, like copy and paste and notifications. If Apple can tart up some of the software features in the next 6 months, will the Palm Pre still look so appetizing?


BTW, the method of app switching looks so much like the jailbreak feature "Dock", displayed so inelegantly here:

YouTube - iPhone App Update - Dock (http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=0yAKZeSJTXY)

Exocet
9th January 2009, 11:01 PM
Honestly the thing that got me most excited regarding the iPhone was not "OMG AN APPLE PHONE"...it was more the fact that it would induce competition from the traditional SERIOUS players.

This is the first example of a real competitor I've seen to iPhone.

macnwindows
9th January 2009, 11:18 PM
There are some similarities to the iPhone(external look and OS) but looks better as compared to other so called 'iPhone killers'. But I am afraid by the time it is released & tested, the iPhone will have new look/firmware/better specs etc(at least announced). Apple was the first to introduce iPhone like device so anything released after that looks just a failed attempt and hasn't reached up to the standard of the iPhone. Personally, I can't see myself making a switch unless a new iPhone comes out :D

iCameron
10th January 2009, 12:20 AM
I would love to get this!

However, I have little need for a phone!

but I love the advancement in phone technology and the competition that the launch of Android and now the Palm Pre have created with the iPhone.

Only time will tell how popular these devices are vs. the iPhone but it keeps Apple awake that they dont need to just have one release of the iPhone but they must continually update it's software/hardware to bring it into line with the rest of the market.

COMPETITION = GOOD

MONOPOLY = BAD (Though, the game is kickass!)

spilla
10th January 2009, 12:23 AM
The UI & OS look awesome, but I'm not sold on the design of the handset. It looks too much like a jellybean/kids toy.

Chris2008
10th January 2009, 02:06 AM
Looks great to me. Especially the top nav bar.
Hope it's premium quality from HTC as I was disappointed with the Diamond

choy
10th January 2009, 02:08 AM
AS a longtime user and seller of smartphones over the last decade, I am happy to see palm making a valiant effort to get out of the huge hole they dug for themselves.

THey were the first to truly innovate in the early days(well, handspring anyway) with the visor phone/pdas, and then subsequently dropped the ball when they failed to upgrade PalmOS for the modern era. Then they sold themselves out by making windows mobile smartphones!

I think they realised how much they shot themselves in the foot with the latter move, and I think hiring ex-apple staff (Jon Rubenstein, primarily but apparently quite a few ex apple staff have joined him since 2007) has been a key to them truly reinvigorating the company.

This phone truly has the potential to offer up real compettition to the iPhone, and I am happy to see some real compettition.

Windows Mobile is increasingly mirroring the mess of windows for PC, with so many different phones running it that compatibility, performance etc are a big issue (the mobile VP at CES was actually quoted saying he wants windows mobile on *less* devices to help sort out the mess)

RIM is in the same boat palm was in, with an OS that is really not suited for more than email. The lacklustre performance of the storm is testament to that

Android is what everyone thought would be the smashing success, but it has been a little bit if a non-starter, with limited features currently (not even a virtual keyboard yet!)

The question is whether Palm can get their arse into gear and actually deliver this on time without serious bugs and incompatibilities. Also whether Apple are going to sufficiently evolve to meet the challenge. Did anybody notice how apple the device is? From the dock on the bottom to the font used, it's all very apple-esque

All in all I am much more excited about what 2009 is going to bring for the smartphone world!

mechcon
10th January 2009, 05:09 AM
Here's hoping Palm improve their Mac software...

boddiz
10th January 2009, 09:38 AM
There are some similarities to the iPhone(external look and OS) but looks better as compared to other so called 'iPhone killers'. But I am afraid by the time it is released & tested, the iPhone will have new look/firmware/better specs etc(at least announced). Apple was the first to introduce iPhone like device so anything released after that looks just a failed attempt and hasn't reached up to the standard of the iPhone. Personally, I can't see myself making a switch unless a new iPhone comes out :D



ut I am afraid by the time it is released & tested, the iPhone will have new look/firmware/better specs etc(at least announced).

Sources? Anything other than the firmware is pure guesses.



Apple was the first to introduce iPhone like device so anything released after that looks just a failed attempt and hasn't reached up to the standard of the iPhone.

Apple released a touchscreen phone, with a easy to use operating system.
So in your eyes, EVERY phone after the iPhone is just a failed attempt? what a joke.
Apple has sold just over 10 million iphones worldwide, in over 2 years.
Nokia sold more than 100 million phone worldwide, in one quarter (3 months)!


We only have to go back to the Blackberry Storm to see how a product with a heap of potential can quickly become a heap of steaming turd.

This is one of the only proper arguments in this thread. The storm was so overly hyped that everyone had too high expectations for it.

timothy
10th January 2009, 10:36 AM
Until you have a play with one of these it would be hard to say...

Watching the videos you could see it did not look like a killer music player and the photo viewer also struggled in the video I saw.

Really good to see something that has a new interface put up a challenge...

But I personally thought it started to get messy and confusing, so I would need to have a fiddle myself before I could judge it.

Business people will like this and all the people who just cannot be seen using an iPhone will like it.

Apple is pretty cheeky leaving out many features because at any stage they can just "BOOM" copy/paste, better camera with video capture, bluetooth accessories etc... They can check out all the popular Jail break stuff and just implement something even better than these cards you seem to have to give a fairly big vertical flick to throw away.

Sad but true is that this Palm Pre could easily flop in it's first release, but the software can only improve and hopefully it will push all of the handheld market forward. Maybe the Palm Pre2 in 2010 will absolutely blow us away!!!

Choice is good.

lavo
10th January 2009, 11:15 AM
Looking at the Pre leads me to think the Jon Rubenstein might have had a bigger hand than what we think at Apple in designing products.

With iTunes going DRM-free, you still have access to the world's best online music store. What might be an interesting move from Palm is the development environment for the WebOS it runs. All based on standard web technologies such as HTML, CSS and Javascript, it might be a lot easier for apps to be developed for it than the iPhone. Plus, they also have a pathway for previous Palm developers to migrate from pdb files to the new system.

I'm very excited about this move from Palm! I don't think Apple would have expected it, considering the tripe Palm have pumped out in the last few years. It has shades of what Palm did to Apple with the Newton. Not exactly the same, but there are some similarities :-)

My tip - keep an eye on HTC this year as a potential buyer of Palm ;-)

vecsty
10th January 2009, 11:29 AM
----------------

Comet
10th January 2009, 11:52 AM
I think the question now is how long will it take for them to get it out to the global market. Sprint isn't the best network in the US, so if they're going to be the only carrier selling this for 2009, then it might not be a success for Palm.

Either way, it's an exciting gadget and would love to play around with it. The target market is going to be the traditional palm users, which is businesses mainly, so it probably won't sell like the iPhone. Still, from a business user's point of view, this seems like the better option than the iPhone.

harps
10th January 2009, 12:54 PM
As a former Palm user I am really excited about this product. I've had to switch across to a BlackBerry due to work IT limitations, but from what I have seen so far I feel this is the device that will get me to come back to Palm.

I'm really excited about the ability to have it connecting to both work and personal PIM without causing conflict issues like I've had in the past with both Palm and BlackBerry, which resulted in me ending up giving up trying to do.

I hope that the 3G/GSM version that is supposedly going to be launched at the same times as the CDMA model announced is a real HSDPA 3G operating off UMTS 850Mhz/1900/2100Mhz bands, and not just the UMTS/HSPA 2100Mhz band that other so called 3G devices work on. I.e. is NextG compatible.

Fingers crossed we see something here in Australia around the middle of the year, and not some time in 2010 like most product releases.

marc
10th January 2009, 01:04 PM
Looks really good.

I think Palm will do very well with it. Good on them, they've been lost for a while... they're back, baby!

boddiz
10th January 2009, 01:05 PM
I think the question now is how long will it take for them to get it out to the global market. Sprint isn't the best network in the US, so if they're going to be the only carrier selling this for 2009, then it might not be a success for Palm.

Either way, it's an exciting gadget and would love to play around with it. The target market is going to be the traditional palm users, which is businesses mainly, so it probably won't sell like the iPhone. Still, from a business user's point of view, this seems like the better option than the iPhone.

Engadget has reported that europe will be getting the gsm version at the same time as the us. I imagine the rest of the world shouldnt be too far behind.

godsdice
10th January 2009, 01:19 PM
Very nice..!
Not as appealing as the iPhone though.

ziggotron
10th January 2009, 01:27 PM
This really tackles one of the major things that I have gripes with about the iPhone, such as multitasking, not being able to send files through Bluetooth, and MMS; The Pre does multitasking wonderfully with the WebOS.

It also provides a similar if not better a better UI in some parts, like the gesture bar where you swipe it to go back a page, or use it to scroll down a webpage (in horizontal view) and not hamper what you're viewing.

Well seeing the Palm Pre, I really hope Apple does something really special in its next firmware or hardware release. Although a great phone as it is already, the iPhone is really lacking in multitasking, and quite frankly it is just slow when you're switching between one app and another (with the minimising animation and all, every second adds up). I just hope Apple can come up with something on that front.

PatrickH
10th January 2009, 02:48 PM
I have a good feeling that Palm's going to have a good year for 2009.

Their product looks awesome and wish them all the sucess, but i'll still be saving up for an outright iPhone. :)

anarchron
10th January 2009, 02:51 PM
If the Palm Pre is released before the iPhone 4G, then I'll definitely be jumping ship. The most exciting thing about the Palm Pre is the Web OS. Finally, I'll be able to develop my own apps without having to learn yucky Objective-C and Cocoa.

I love how you can also charge it wirelessly. If they can couple this with wireless bluetooth syncing then this definitely could be a potential iPhone killer. Oh and it's also great that it will be released in Europe and the US at the same time, unlike the iPhone which spent nearly the first year of its life being a US exclusive.

decryption
10th January 2009, 03:30 PM
The Palm SDK & developer program is apparently much more developer friendly than the tyrannical Apple:

The pre's got Mojo: a developer speaks about Palm's new SDK (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20090109-the-pres-got-mojo-a-developer-speaks-about-palms-new-sdk.html)

esm
10th January 2009, 10:49 PM
My very first PDA was a Handspring Visor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handspring_(company)#Visor_and_Visor_Deluxe) which was running PalmOS. Fantastic for what it was at the time!

I too enjoyed Handspring visor too during my younger days... hahaha.

aafuss
10th January 2009, 11:25 PM
Me too-hope the Pre will have much better Mac sync software.

Jaffa
11th January 2009, 09:56 AM
Well seeing the Palm Pre, I really hope Apple does something really special in its next firmware or hardware release. Although a great phone as it is already, the iPhone is really lacking in multitasking, and quite frankly it is just slow when you're switching between one app and another (with the minimising animation and all, every second adds up). I just hope Apple can come up with something on that front.

I agree with you there, I love my iPhone much better, but I think Apple need to learn a few things from the Palm Pre because as good as their device is yes, every second adds up.

applebyte
11th January 2009, 01:18 PM
This looks insane!

I thought no other mobile phone could match the iphone in terms of UI. The pre looks to debunk that belief - with more features to boot!

Can't wait, any word on Aussie release? Glad to see it on the palm.com.au front page :)

vecsty
11th January 2009, 01:42 PM
----------------

Stevejme
11th January 2009, 03:31 PM
Another Palm product destined for the dust bin. They haven' released anything of real value since the Palm V.

dolbinau
11th January 2009, 06:39 PM
Another Palm product destined for the dust bin. They haven' released anything of real value since the Palm V.

wtf?

NeoRicen
11th January 2009, 07:05 PM
Looks nice, has the best UI of any iPhone competition I've seen, which I like, but the things I love about my iPhone such as iTunes integration and syncing calendars and contacts with the mac and MobileMe (yeah I use MobileMe, bite me) aren't there yet, as far as I can tell).

Also the iPhone hardware looks much nicer, and I'm one of the few who is glad Apple ditched a hardware keyboard, so the inclusion of one on the Palm is a negative for me.

Will be nice to see what Apple has up its sleeves for June, hopefully more powerful hardware.

p53
11th January 2009, 08:27 PM
If only the iPhone had unobtrusive notifications like the Palm Pre; I really like the status bar thingo. Come to think of it those pop up notifications on the iPhone are really annoying.

mcargy08
13th January 2009, 08:58 PM
this is really an iPhone killer. nice with the gestures and all...

zacbookpro
13th January 2009, 09:55 PM
needs some more storage to compete on a media level

but all in all, very interested and am ready to swap!

macnwindows
14th January 2009, 09:22 AM
Sources? Anything other than the firmware is pure guesses.

Apple released a touchscreen phone, with a easy to use operating system.
So in your eyes, EVERY phone after the iPhone is just a failed attempt? what a joke.
Apple has sold just over 10 million iphones worldwide, in over 2 years.
Nokia sold more than 100 million phone worldwide, in one quarter (3 months)!
.


It is a pure guess but do you have a source that will prove it won't happen!

I meant 'anything released after iPhone as an attempt to match/beat it' looks like a failed attempt.

As far as numbers are concerned, look at the number of models Nokia is selling and the amount of time they have spent in the mobile phone industry. It's no brainer that Nokia sells more phones than any other manufacturer. Also the first iPhone was released in only a few countries, the number would have been bigger otherwise.

Piratbyran
15th January 2009, 09:37 AM
A challenger you say? Not a chance.

*face PALMs*

Trabb
15th January 2009, 10:01 AM
When do they reckon this thing will hit the market?

drewbles
15th January 2009, 10:28 AM
wtf?

I second that. What the Frig?

The Pre looks Great. I've had a 2G and now 3G iPhone, and if this is as good as it looks, i'll be swapping. The lack of multi tasking is driving me nuts (and yes i know you can do it in a jailbreak, but i'm sick of hacking).

Good on you Palm. I used to love your products (have an old Treo 650 in my drawer here). Here's hoping they're back!

blk7
16th January 2009, 12:59 PM
The Pre, as demoed, is really impressive. If they can get a phone to do all this and still manage decent battery life, it will be awesome.

Of course, I'm sticking with my iPhone. I'm kind of locked to the platform now (willingly enough).

Can't wait to see how the iPhone firmware progresses. The Pre can only provide impetus for Apple to innovate further.

dolbinau
17th January 2009, 10:08 AM
http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/9608/picture3qs3.png

WindowsVista
17th January 2009, 01:17 PM
http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/9608/picture3qs3.png

That is what I call AWESOME:D

zacbookpro
17th January 2009, 01:35 PM
people who make an educated decision vs. sheep.

(I own an iphone, for now atleast.)

morn
17th January 2009, 06:21 PM
The Palm Pre will probably do very well, but it's not really a threat to the iPhone.
For starters they can't match the App store and the itunes integration that makes it the best media phone.
They have attacked the iPhone where it is weakest which is smart, multitasking and background apps and a keyboard, that should get the people who want the iPhone but are critical of these aspects.
But the biggest flaw is it's application environment. Javascript and HTML? Hehe pathetic, so the Palm Pre is going to pretty much have widgets... While the iPhone will have 3D games, voice recognition apps, music apps and image processing apps. They have a real application environment based on a desktop operating system. Not java like android or OPL like symbian. But the full capabilities of a desktop programming environment.

blk7
22nd January 2009, 07:48 PM
To give them credit, there is a vision of how the phone will fit with the owner's lifestyle. They are really the first company to do this with a smartphone since Apple launched the iPhone.

Everyone else is still caught up in producing something that has the same look but a better featureset.

There is still a lot of unknown's where the platform is concerned. But I respect that are trying to do more than just build a phone.

And it's exciting because it's a reminder that there is a whole lot more that Apple can do to progress iPhone as a platform.

DazR6
22nd January 2009, 08:23 PM
Well I have to say iPhone looks way better then that, so to me it's boring and cluncky I'm staying with iPhone and I think we will see iPhone blow that crap away.

dolbinau
23rd January 2009, 08:12 AM
pffff

Blue Water Boy
16th February 2009, 10:11 PM
its a cool phone, but as you said anthony, i didn't see many things that are truly unique to the Pre. Apple could so implement things like the cards without much scrutiny...(Safari "windows")

im looking forward to what ever apple comes up with to make the iPhone better :)