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dche5390
20th November 2008, 11:23 AM
Hi everyone,

Thought I'd share my experience and open myself to a lot of snide remarks but I think its better for the general public to know of what avenues are available should they make the mistake of getting scammed by someone on eBay. I've learnt in life that its ok to admit to mistakes and I hope this may provide help to anyone else in a similar unfortunately circumstance (you're not alone). Despite having used eBay for many years now as buyer and seller, errors in judgement do occur.

My story is quite simple: I was stupid. I contacted a seller for a MBP "instant price". Gave them my mobile number and they called me back. Liaised with seller via email and phone conversation. Proceeded to pay via bank deposit (AHA! Theres the No. 1 mistake!). Seller confirmed receipt of payment. Have had no contact since. The number that they called me is disconnected as well.

Like every other scam victim, I can only blame myself for being too eager in the sale. It is not a fault with eBay or any other online auction website. It is not a problem with the system but the simply fact that we as human beings are greedy. The saying "if its too good to be true.." exists for a reason. I let my own greed take over and despite tiny alarm bells ringing in the back of my mind, I refused to listen to common sense, and have paid a significant financial price.

I was promised an email concerning tracking numbers for the mailed item. Since payment, all correspondence from the seller has ceased. I have called, emailed, and politely asked for him/her/them to call me back, but obviously, nothing has eventuated.

Using eBay's "find a member's contact details" function, I was able to get another landline number. Unfortunately, this number does not work operater simply states the line is disconnected.

What I do have is email correspondence between the seller and myself. I have full banking details. I have 2 bogus landlines. I have an alias (name and email account). And to my knowledge, I have the support of eBay and the Police. I have every intention of nailing this bastard via legal avenues.

I did some googling and found on another forum, someone else had been scammed earlier this year, and had proceeded to pay via bank deposit to the identical Account Name. My suspicions were now confirmed.

I'd like to thank eBay however for being helpful in my process of tracking down the scammer. Live Chat, since its introduction, has IMO allowed many scammed people vent. Admitting that one has been tricked is no easy feat and having someone to disclose this information is a great resource. Each Ebay Chat assistant has been polite, professional, encouraging, and helpful. Although I still have to wait another week before I can formally lodge an "Item not received" dispute, I was made aware that I could contact the Ebay Trust & Safey Department and notify them of the false contact number listed with their database. I have done so and been notified that they will investigate accordingly.

Fortunately for me, the amount lost does not adversly affect me financially (others may not be so lucky). My ego of course is bruised and I have a bitter taste in my mouth (or I should just brush my teeth after having ciggies and coffees). I've said it, it was my fault and I am/will pay for it financially and/or psychologically.

"A fool and his money are soon to depart" how very true.

That concludes my "show and tell" session for today.
Cheers,
Dan

So in summary:

Things that fooled me:
Having an eBay listing specific for my sale (I thought, hey, if this guy is willing to do this, then it should be safe!)
Given a landline number (its no good getting a number if you cannot verify its authenticity in my case, it rings and a voice message of the "seller" answers, but that is all)
Hearing a friendly voice on the phone (well constructed, well presented telephone conversation about payment, price etc fooled me!)


Things I should have listened to:
Zero feedback/New eBay member
Bank deposit payment
Lame reason for sale (FYI puppy got run over, cover Vet bills etc)
Generic photograph of item that was probably pulled from google images
Bank deposit name not matching eBay member's ID


If there is anything to take from my story it is this: make payment thru PayPal and PayPal ONLY, and don't rush into things without clear and careful thought.

I will upate this thread accordingly when I have lodged my dispute with eBay and filed a Fraud clain with the police and subsequent Small Claims via the courts.

givememac
20th November 2008, 11:38 AM
oh shit that sucks :(

But thanks for posting so others can read!
Paypal is super sucky in terms of fees and such, but it definitely pulls through if you've been scammed!
Have you tried contacting your bank regarding the scam? Sometimes they can get it back if you tell them the story

applecollector
20th November 2008, 11:44 AM
Whats his ebay name?

vargz
20th November 2008, 11:47 AM
Sorry to hear your story.



I have every intention of nailing this bastard via legal avenues.


Can the police find it who it is from his bank account details?

Wally
20th November 2008, 11:57 AM
The mobile phone account number would require some form of identification.

Give that to the police as well, they'll be able to trace it one way or another.

A good idea is to ask the seller to provide a picture of the item with the ebay name beside is.

Tis sad really.

Wally

mitty
20th November 2008, 12:05 PM
You know what you did wrong so there's no reason for any of us to point it out or flame you. At least you've had the good sense to post it here and hopefully someone else won't make the same mistake. Also, hopefully the scammer will get what's coming to them, either now or later in life.

Don't forget, what goes around comes around.

stewiesno1
20th November 2008, 12:11 PM
Yes, nail him if you can find him.
Good Luck.

Stewie

dche5390
20th November 2008, 12:11 PM
oh shit that sucks :(

But thanks for posting so others can read!
Paypal is super sucky in terms of fees and such, but it definitely pulls through if you've been scammed!
Have you tried contacting your bank regarding the scam? Sometimes they can get it back if you tell them the story

I believe the correct legal proceedings would be wait the 10 days to file an "item not received" with eBay. Once I have a case number, I then give the police a visit, state my claim, direct them to eBay, and hand over any evidence I have.

The police website (for each state/territory) clearly states that they will not act until they have a case number from eBay/oZtion etc etc. Hence I don't wish to waste their time until I have done so.

Banks, and any organisation now have strict rules on giving out confidential information. But I will give it a go nevertherless, and remember to be courteous. Wonder if CBA CS have been properly trained in this regard.

Interesting to have just read the St George (my banking institution) has merged with Westpac. Time to test if their CS is still at the same excellent level.


Whats his ebay name?

I don't wish to disclose that information just yet. Account has been reported to ebay for investigation.


Sorry to hear your story.

Can the police find it who it is from his bank account details?

As per above.
I bloody hope the are competent. I assume its not very hard since its not easy to set up bogus bank accounts..well, for the average joe that is. This person/group appear to be quite organised with fake numbers and alias, and apparently, has been around various auction sites scamming people. CSI makes me believe that they can do anything!


The mobile phone account number would require some form of identification.

Give that to the police as well, they'll be able to trace it one way or another.

A good idea is to ask the seller to provide a picture of the item with the ebay name beside is.


I did not get a mobile number. I do have 2 landlines, both which appear to be within NSW. I even managed to whitepage (NOT google..lol) the alias I was given and it gave me an exact hit to someone residing in Paddington, Sydney. I was surprised as the seller had told me he was in Darwin, NT.

As stated above, I have every intention on handing over any material that may help my cause. I have many years ago been scammed money from yahoo auctions but I let that pass - not this time. I intend to nail this bastard with everything I have. Plus, I'm bored...

harryb2448
20th November 2008, 12:20 PM
Good luck and trust all will come okay for you. Rotten SOB!

Remember the hue and cry, letters to Fair Trading etc., when eBay wanted all transaction to be done through PayPal? Might force some of these bastards out of the market place.

dche5390
20th November 2008, 12:32 PM
You know what you did wrong so there's no reason for any of us to point it out or flame you. At least you've had the good sense to post it here and hopefully someone else won't make the same mistake. Also, hopefully the scammer will get what's coming to them, either now or later in life.

Don't forget, what goes around comes around.

Interesting to see the different responses I get from MTAU as opposed to OCAU. I'm hoping that future prospective buyers when doing a search find this thread and stop them from repeating the same mistakes I have made.

Sooner or later, the scammer will be caught, but it would make my life much more interesting if I nailed them - thats what I call christmas cheer.

I was thinking, would mX be interested in such an article?

thebookfreak58
20th November 2008, 12:34 PM
Do a reverse lookup on the landlines. First google result for "grey pages". Should get you some more info.

mitty
20th November 2008, 12:40 PM
^you could give it a try. I'm sure they'd love to send out a photographer and get a pic of you looking sad and depressed, but do you really want that facing you when you get on the train this evening? ;)

Oh and agreed with OCAU. I hate those forums... I am a member there but rarely hangout at all. Most of em have chips on their shoulders the size of Texas.

gikku
20th November 2008, 12:43 PM
The Police fraud team may be interested.

My experience;
I recently had a call from the wallopers about a successful bid I made on a phone last year, the sale never proceeded because the seller kept refusing my Paypal payments and asking that I direct bank deposit instead. I wasn't going to make a bank deposit payment.

Anyways, after other complaints where buyers did make bank payments and never received their phones, the coppers have a guy in custody and have charged him.

You wont get your goods or money, but they might lock them up.

gelfie
20th November 2008, 12:45 PM
The vet thing isn't THAT lame.

My beautiful cat needed some surgery a few months back. To remove a skin cancer lump. $850 estimated cost. Fortunately I could afford it. But if I couldn't... I'd absolutely part with my beloved (and only) mac in order to save my best buddy.

Also lots of well respected users with lots of sales and good reps have their accounts cracked and the scammer uses their reputation to run his scam.

Or they make a new account, and sell some trivial, or even fictional stuff to buddies with their own accounts, in order to build up their own reputation.

Ebay is just a dangerous place in general for big ticket items.

dche5390
20th November 2008, 12:47 PM
Do a reverse lookup on the landlines. First google result for "grey pages". Should get you some more info.

Interesting, I've got a name and address...certainly not the one that I found from White Pages.


The vet thing isn't THAT lame.

Ebay is just a dangerous place in general for big ticket items.

I agree on both accounts. Hence I was fooled coz poor pup got run over (and I am well aware of vet fees) although I was surprised when I offered $1700, they only wanted $1300....conscience perhaps?

cactus68
20th November 2008, 01:08 PM
hope you track down the bastard and get your money back.

With 0 feedback, i wouldn't of considered a deal outside of ebay.
Then the reason about the puppy and vet bills would have done it for sure!

I got done once when i purchased some epson print cartridges from Germany.
Was listed as "Genuine".
He had sold a few qty's to others.
When mine arrived all looked fine, looked like the real deal with hologram logos etc etc.
When it came time for me to use one of the cartridges the unit didn't work.
Tried another one (purchased 4) and same thing.

They ended up being non-genuine made in Mexico!
By then some others who had purchased these from this ebayer were leaving
neg feedback about the dud items.
Tried to contact him but no reply.
Ended up contacting all the ebayers who purchased the duds and got some replys.
One from Holland that actually tracked him down and got her money back.
She gave me the details she had. With a bit of extra searching on the net I managed to find a
friggin photo of this guy, who he associated with (some Germany soccer player!)

Ended up emailing him with his photo attached. Details of the who I will contact at the German police dept plus details of Aust. Fed Police and that I had contacts in Europe if needed! ;)

Plus i insisted on compensation as well.

Ended up getting all my money plus the compo!

He said that he actually got scammed without realising it when he purchased a box of the cartridges to on-sell. He had already been investigated and fined plus refunding costs to other ebayers.


So, persistence does pay, keep going with it buddy and don't give up!

dche5390
20th November 2008, 01:15 PM
Just to clear things up, the deal was made within eBay. The seller did initiate a "proper" listing with a starting price of $1300, whereby upon my bid, would close. This is what has happened so at least there is a formal record of the sale as well as eBay's own system of acknowledging payment via bank deposit.

I've done a reverse phone search and got a name and address in Sydney. Only 1 of the 3 phone numbers actually worked and it so happened to be the one that he gave me in his correspondence. Thru White Pages I got the address for this number, and although the names and address do not match between Grey/White pages, I have 2 sets of names at least. Funny enough, the original address I had obtained from White Pages, through Grey Pages, gave me another set of numbers.

I hope I get this guy too. I got a suggestion from someone on OCAU to ask my bank to do a reverse claiming that there was an error in account number etc. Not sure how that will go but I'm willing to give it a go (I mean, I've got nothing to lose).

arkenstone
20th November 2008, 01:36 PM
I had a similar problem recently but because I paid with PayPal the full amount was refunded as soon as I'd gone through all the steps ebay and PayPal asked me to go through.

I always try to pay with paypal or credit card now, as both offer protection.

Japester
20th November 2008, 02:27 PM
You're no fool--I'm the fool. Back in 2003 I was gypped out of $7000. This was when a scam had not yet garnered a lot of attention on eBay. Here's how it works:

1. Offer an insane package and price it low. In this case, it was a PowerMac G5 (first gen) Dual 2.0GHz, fully specced, 23" and 20" Cinema Displays and a 30Gb iPod, all for $3500AUS.
2. In the listing, demand that buyers register their interest, ostensibly to weed out non-serious people.
3. Don't reply to the frantic emails sent by the victim.
4. Let the listing expire, or cancel it.
5. The victim, now in a tizzy, is now responded to and payment secured, then the seller disappears.

I was stupid enough to do it once. Then I was stupider enough to do the same thing again almost immediately. On the second scam, I actually conversed with the "seller", who, after a bit of back and forth, turned out to be a guy in Brisbane who had had his account stolen. The bastard doing the scam masqueraded as this legitimate seller. Adding to the confusion was the fact that the seller had in fact just sold something, but it was something completely different.

Of course, the story sold it. The G5 was new at the time, and these listings were for complete packages that had been used as demonstration units in European countries. The demo was over, the guy got it cheap, he passed on the savings to the eBayer.

I was familiar enough with eBay's policies to know that completing a sale outside eBay was against the rules and afforded no protection. Greed made me do an incredibly stupid thing and I'm still paying off that $7000 today. I alerted eBay but they didn't get it. I told them up front that I knew I did the wrong thing and didn't expect protection, I was merely letting them know what happened. I just got robotic responses chanting the rules at me.

I will never do this again, of course. I ended up paying $4200 for a dual 1.8GHz model at NextByte Chatswood. It turned out to be a pretty good price considering the small tweaks I did to the BTO.

dche5390
20th November 2008, 02:42 PM
You're no fool--I'm the fool. Back in 2003

Haha, no I INSIST I am the fool!

Back in 2000, I was still in highschool (year 10). eBay Aus was still a crappy little website with absolutely no buyer protection. I purchased and paid for a $200 Motorola V880 (those where the BOMB back then) for my sister's birthday. It actually arrived albeit broken, without any accessories. It had simply been dumped inside a 500g sachet and posted to me.

Being a kid, I did not know what to do, I let it go. $200 back then (and still is) a lot of money for a high school kid who worked hard at Maccas. Never was on youth allowance or what shit as I don't like playing the system.

Fast foward another 2 years, and yet AGAIN I got scammed. This time, via Yahoo Auctions HK. This scammer was quite a pro, or rather, picked up immediately I was a n00b. I paid for 2x Docomo mobile phones (at the time, they were WAY ahead in mobile tech). This set me back $400. He called me frequently from Melbourne and I was conned into believing that he was a trustworthy guy. Paid via bank deposit (again). I figured things went wrong when I called him and he said "oh, no monies has come through". Subsequently, he no longer picked up the phone and I was out of pocket again - still a high school student in yr 12 at the time.

I used to buy a lot of second hand phones from Yahoo Auctions HK, sell them on eBay before I even received them. This was back in 2001 I think when I was in year 11 (till 2003, 1st year uni). I made a shitload of money selling phones this way despite covering for international bank deposits ($40AUD at the time) and EMS ($30AUD at the time). I am ashamed to say I probably started the precedent of all these annoying Chinese imported goods on eBay Aus. I should have kept my mouth shout and kept then niche market all to myself.

I haven't been scammed until a few days ago. The first two instances were because I was naive and felt powerless. Both instances screwed me up as I had limited money. This time round, I really take the cherry for being a dumbc*nt, but at least I have savings and although $1300 is a large sum by any standard, it hasn't caused me too much grief. With that said, I am now older, a bit more mature, have much more life experience behind me and determination to do all that I can to get this guy.

Called the Cops, they told me to pop into any branch and fill out a "Fraud Assessment Sheet" which I will when I get off work.

Bastard Sheep
20th November 2008, 03:42 PM
Haha, no I INSIST I am the fool!

Fool? I'll tell you who's a fool. Back in 1979 when I was still in my dad's testies, eBay hadn't even been thought of at the time and one of my brother sperm told me about his third cousin twice removed's issue he was having in some foreign land. Apparently he had a few billion sperm-dollars but needed a short cash injection to get access to that money.

Well, I was -9.1 months old and naieve at the time, so I ponied on up. A few days later as I was heading to the local watering hole to get a drink I swear he had something planned for me. A trap. I saw him out of the corner of my eye, then there was this low rumbling and then all of a sudden chaos from everywhere. He must have drugged me or something because the whole world went crazy. There were huge explosions, sperm running all over the place in this strange land I had never seen before. Next thing I know we all go flying out in to this big cavernous enclave the likes of which I had never seen. So open, so free.

My brother sperm going in all directions, everyone confused. Our homes, our families in complete disarray. No sign of this bastard and his supposed "cousin", so I did the only thing I could do. I ran. I decided the best direction was up as what ever had caused that strangeness surely wouldn't be able to make it up there. Kind of like a marsupial climbing a tree to get away from a predator. The higher I climbed the tighter things got, I was feeling more comfortable again until I came across this strange orb.

It was the most strange and majestic thing I had ever seen before. So beautiful. I had to get closer, to touch it, to be one with it. I was drawn to it like an insect to the light. Such heavenly bliss I could not refuse. Finally after what felt like an eternity I found a way to get inside.

I never saw that brother sperm again. As I was climbing I heard he fell out the gap in the bottom. Probably with my money too, the bastard. I don't have any hope of getting it back, but to this day 29 years later I am still trying.

wseries
20th November 2008, 04:17 PM
Live and learn hey? Despite being scammed, I reckon you have a good attitude. Also, by sharing your tale of woe you prevent others from making the same mistakes.

My advice for anyone considering a major purchase is to arrange to pick the item up in person. That way, you don't hand over any cash until you know the goods are real and in your hands. It's a strict rule I live by and it has served me well for all purchases I've considered over about $150. If the item I'm interested in is interstate then I keep looking.

Further to this, during bidding I'll often email the seller and ask if it's okay to pick the item up in person if they haven't said as much on their listing. If they say yes it's usually a good indication they're fair dinkum. If they say no, then I won't bid. As I said, it's a rule that has served me well.

Anyway, good luck with things dche5390. I hope you have some success recovering some (or all) of your money.

digoxin
20th November 2008, 04:31 PM
Fool? I'll tell you who's a fool. Back in 1979 when I was still in my dad's testies, eBay hadn't even been thought of at the time and one of my brother sperm told me about his third cousin twice removed's issue he was having in some foreign land. Apparently he had a few billion sperm-dollars but needed a short cash injection to get access to that money.

Well, I was -9.1 months old and naieve at the time, so I ponied on up. A few days later as I was heading to the local watering hole to get a drink I swear he had something planned for me. A trap. I saw him out of the corner of my eye, then there was this low rumbling and then all of a sudden chaos from everywhere. He must have drugged me or something because the whole world went crazy. There were huge explosions, sperm running all over the place in this strange land I had never seen before. Next thing I know we all go flying out in to this big cavernous enclave the likes of which I had never seen. So open, so free.

My brother sperm going in all directions, everyone confused. Our homes, our families in complete disarray. No sign of this bastard and his supposed "cousin", so I did the only thing I could do. I ran. I decided the best direction was up as what ever had caused that strangeness surely wouldn't be able to make it up there. Kind of like a marsupial climbing a tree to get away from a predator. The higher I climbed the tighter things got, I was feeling more comfortable again until I came across this strange orb.

It was the most strange and majestic thing I had ever seen before. So beautiful. I had to get closer, to touch it, to be one with it. I was drawn to it like an insect to the light. Such heavenly bliss I could not refuse. Finally after what felt like an eternity I found a way to get inside.

I never saw that brother sperm again. As I was climbing I heard he fell out the gap in the bottom. Probably with my money too, the bastard. I don't have any hope of getting it back, but to this day 29 years later I am still trying.

did your dad use the condoms from dealextreme?;)

http://forums.mactalk.com.au/10/62159-would-you-buy-condoms-deal-extreme.html

ziggotron
20th November 2008, 05:00 PM
Similar story happened to me too, just a while ago. Greed blinded me and I lost $545. I think these people have the perfect crime set up. Even if you have their BSB, and name etc, the banks have no power to give out details because of the Privacy Act.

I hope you can catch the bastard.. had no luck with mine. Could only get as far as to his general location through the BSB number.

BoxDog
20th November 2008, 05:02 PM
digoxin, did you really have to quote an entire post just to post a dad-joke?

To the OP, mate really sorry to hear what happened. The other day u said you got this deal in the $1799 MacBook thread and my red flag went off but I didn't think anything of it and assumed u had done your due diligence. Hope you nail the bastard. In the meantime I know someone who's selling a quad core Mac Pro for $900 if you're keen ;) jk but I can vouch for the $1799 guy if you're still keen (PM if I can help in any way)

dche5390
20th November 2008, 05:18 PM
digoxin, did you really have to quote an entire post just to post a dad-joke?

To the OP, mate really sorry to hear what happened. The other day u said you got this deal in the $1799 MacBook thread and my red flag went off but I didn't think anything of it and assumed u had done your due diligence. Hope you nail the bastard. In the meantime I know someone who's selling a quad core Mac Pro for $900 if you're keen ;) jk but I can vouch for the $1799 guy if you're still keen (PM if I can help in any way)

Thanks BoxDog. Yes, I wish I had followed through with the Melb based seller from eBay that you purchased your MB from.

Did not get the whole condom post prob will get to reading it later tonite for laughs.

Mac Pro for $900? Sweet! Can I send you cash in an envelop?

RiGo
20th November 2008, 09:11 PM
Hope you catch him... I've been an eBay member for about 7 years and luckily I haven't suffered any scams in that time. Got the odd item-not-quite-as-described but 99.9% of my experience has been positive.

Good luck!

jarrodb
20th November 2008, 10:04 PM
Since we're all out fooling each other....

I got stung in June this year by some 'way too cheap' ex-demo imacs on the brand new Trading Post online auctions. The auction part of the site had only just started and was not advertised yet. To get it going they were offered free listings I think until the end of September. Anyway, this scammer listed a whole heap of stuff, around 50 items all ex-demo, ex-display, factory second types of computers, laptops, big screen TV's etc.

The guys feedback was positive, some said he was difficult to deal with but they got their stuff. I ended up grabbing a buy it now for a 24" 3.06Ghz ex-demo imac and stupidly payed via bank deposit. The strange thing was the seller was in pretty regular contact for ages and even refunded half of the money before going silent.

The trading post were completely useless and just referred me to the police. My bank couldn't do anything saying the trace and recover thing was only a 'request' and that was all. I lodged a report at my local police station (in VIC), nothing, not even a phone call back. I used that police website for auction fraud and made another report but they phoned back saying because I had received a part refund my case was only a civil matter and they couldn't do anything.

Using the feedback system on the trading post website a bunch of us stung buyers got together and found out that one of the state police services were prepared to investigate so at least something is happening but this is ONLY because about 20 people got done over by one person.

My experience has told me that the police will only investigate if it qualifies as major fraud due to the huge number of minor cases that these auction sites generate.

The thing is, the Trading Post basically invited dodgy behavior by allowing free listings while they de-bugged their auction system (it was very buggy by the way). I ended up loosing about $800, some lost $3000, others actually received stuff but it was the wrong thing valued at much less than the item they purchased.

So, lessons.

1. If it sounds too good to be true it DEFINITELY is
2. Only ever use paypal if they don't take it bad luck
3. Don't use Trading Post as unlike ebay they don't seem to care very much and they are still learning how to run an auction service

cosmichobo
20th November 2008, 10:37 PM
My worst case story was not entirely all bad... I at least got the goods, however they weren't in the condition promised... iBook 300Mhz for $220, and was promised that the battery held a great charge... the battery was DEAD... by the time I got the goods, and realised the problem, the seller had closed his account, and his email bounced.

I've paid for a lot of things off eBay by direct deposit... all 3 laptops I own... as well as smaller items...

Though - I do make sure to keep away from low/no feedback sellers... (!) certainly for big purchases...

schmidty
20th November 2008, 11:47 PM
If there is anything to take from my story it is this: make payment thru PayPal and PayPal ONLY, and don't rush into things without clear and careful thought.

Another approach is to do local pickup whenever you can, and simply pay for the item when you pick it up. This is especially useful for pricier items.

I've bought a couple of guitars on eBay (both for around $1000**). Even though neither seller listed cash on pickup as a payment option, both were happy to accept it when asked. If someone's not willing to take cash, or let you look at the item before buying it (if it's expensive), the you shouldn't trust that person. In fact, a genuine seller should be happy to take cash for an expensive items, as it allows her/him to avoid proportionally high transaction fees (such as PayPal's).

Also, don't be afraid to ask friends for help. One of the above-mentioned guitars was in Sydney, whereas I'm in Melbourne. A friend in Sydney was nice enough to meet the seller and pick up the guitar on my behalf, and I picked it up from him a couple of months later. The only risk there was that my friend knows nothing about guitars. I sent him photos of the guitar that was advertised, and told him a few things to look for to make sure it wasn't a cheaper substitute.


** Fantastic deals. Both were quite new ( < 2 years old), and both less than half retail price. The second, in fact, was a customised version that retails for close to $3000. It needs a service, but I can take it to the factory where it was manufactured (15 minutes' drive from my house) and get it fully serviced for $75. (I really should get onto that. I've had the guitar here since January.)

jubilantjeremy
21st November 2008, 01:10 AM
If I was selling an expensive item on ebay, and some guy asked me if he could come around, look at it, and then pay cash, I would Back The Hell Away.

Being scammed on ebay sounds a lot less foolish than "I let this guy into my place to look at my macbook pro, he punched me in the head and then took the computer".

Huy
21st November 2008, 01:17 AM
That is also my worry, jubilantjeremy.

You sell your MBP. Buyer wants to meet up and pay cash. Sure, he does this. Then he takes your MBP and runs off (and maybe punches you in the face) before giving you any money. He does this because he knows you've got the MBP ready.

Or, let's just say he plays ball. Hands over a wad of cash. You hand over your MBP. 5 minutes later he's got your MBP and attempts to steal his money back. It is potentially risky. I'm not saying this happens all the time. Especially if you are alone or not in a public place. Maybe even worse if you let a stranger into your home and he gets to check out all your other goodies too.

If you're uncomfortable at any stage, back out.

Beau
21st November 2008, 03:08 AM
Greypag.es (http://greypag.es/) if you haven't found it already. ;-)

dche5390
21st November 2008, 09:42 AM
I have some good news with regards to update.

I have been contacted by another ebay member who had been scammed the day before. I gave her a call and she indicated that she had a copy of his passport, mastercard, and bank statement. It appears she would have much more concrete evidence for tracking this guy down.

Another ebay member has also contacted me and I will endevour to work together to collate all our information. I may be the only one who actually carried out the transaction WITHIN ebay so I may have to head it.

Things are looking good so far.

vietnow
21st November 2008, 10:02 AM
she indicated that she had a copy of his passport, mastercard, and bank statement

how the hell did she get ALL that? sounds fishy mate.

arti
21st November 2008, 10:12 AM
Sorry to hear about your bad experience.

I've only ever had one issue on ebay.
Bought a smartphone from a guy with perfect feedback. He advised that it was in perfect condition.

When the phone arrived, it was noticeably used but the most frustrating thing is that it had a scratch on it. This was something I didn't want to let slide.

I emailed him asking for a refund as it was not a described.
He replied stating that the phone is perfect. Obviously a blatant lie as it was crearly heavily used with wears here and there..

Anyway, long story short, I put in a dispute to Paypal (Evil pricks), after 30 days, they close the case stating that they can't see anything wrong.

In over 100 feedbacks, this was my first negative given..
He emailed me claiming that he has sent pictures in to paypal of the phone with no scratches.

Unfortunately, I could not get that scratch to show on camera. Perhaps I should have read a tutorial and adjusting lighting and zoom etc..

Anyway, I gave the phone to my Father who has been using it since.

Hope you get your funds back.

Cheers,
Artii

dche5390
21st November 2008, 10:27 AM
how the hell did she get ALL that? sounds fishy mate.

She apparently did much more research before she paid her money. That just adds to the fact that it was a very believable con despite the obvious warnings. Reminds me of that Lost episode on that con fella.

The information she stated matched what I had. She sounds like a genuine victim of the crime. I guess time will tell.

I'm not sure why the "seller" agreed to send her all this information. Should it even be fake identities, at least that is something they police can investigate further. As a public citizen, I can only do what is legally within my right.

She has emailed me her correspondence and I am trying to schedule a meet as we're both in Sydney.

My priority is not to reclaim my money but rather, nail this SOB on criminal charges. Then, and then only, will I start civil proceedings and make sure every cent he recieves in the future, goes to weekly payments for ripping me off.

Byrd
21st November 2008, 10:31 AM
how the hell did she get ALL that? sounds fishy mate.

I agree - for this person to obtain this sort of sensitive information suggests she works for somewhere where she accessed this information illegally (eg. police, customs, medical, etc) - do not get involved - you could get in a lot of shit being associated with her - and leave it up to them to pursue the matter individually. Even if the information is accurate it will stuff up your chances of taking this eBay seller to court/local authorities if you find them, because I'd say this information has clearly been obtained illegally.

EDIT: just read your post. There is no way someone would send this sort of information (passport, bank details, etc) willingly to another person - scammer or not! Beware. I wouldn't dare meet up with her. Obviously you're angry and have done some good research, but take a deep breath and realise getting your money back will take a long time and lots of hard work, and you should probably do this alone and by the book.

JB

Huy
21st November 2008, 10:46 AM
She apparently did much more research before she paid her money.

The information she stated matched what I had. She sounds like a genuine victim of the crime. I guess time will tell.

She has emailed me her correspondence and I am trying to schedule a meet as we're both in Sydney.

How do you know it's not really him pretending to be a chick? Sounds very suspicious, especially given the kind of information she has about a stranger. Don't meet up. It doesn't sound safe at all.

dche5390
21st November 2008, 10:50 AM
I agree - for this person to obtain this sort of sensitive information suggests she works for somewhere where she accessed this information illegally (eg. police, customs, medical, etc) - do not get involved - you could get in a lot of shit being associated with her - and leave it up to them to pursue the matter individually. Even if the information is accurate it will stuff up your chances of taking this eBay seller to court/local authorities if you find them, because I'd say this information has clearly been obtained illegally.


How do you know it's not really him pretending to be a chick? Sounds very suspicious, especially given the kind of information she has about a stranger. Don't meet up. It doesn't sound safe at all.

Judging by the two responses I got from well-known MTAU members, I think I will heed your advice.

EdgeOfQuarrel
21st November 2008, 11:15 AM
Yeah I could fill a book with ebay horror stories both as a buyer and seller.

I wince everytime someone contacts me offering a price to end it now ect.

SXTACY
21st November 2008, 06:18 PM
MAYBE I CAN HELP!

IT MIGHT BE EBAY'S FAULT!

I also won a MBP from the SAME seller only HOURS before you bought yours!

I also had a chat to the seller, who said he was on holidays in Darwin and therefore, was calling me from a payphone as there's no reception where he was.

Anyways, we spoke a few times on the phone and I refused to pay directly into the account. I suggested COD and he said he really needs the money for his VET.

I noticed on his completed items he had sold 1 before me for $1100... with the same ad and same wording... so I KNEW something was fishy!

Anyways, to cut a long story short... he ended the item in my favour (for $1100) and I was then required to complete the sale as per Ebay's policies.

I knew something wasn't right, so I complained 3 times via Live chat to Ebay! I still have logs of one of the conversations... these were BEFORE you purchased yours!

Because I kept warning Ebay about the nature of the sale, and Ebay did not take reasonable measures to stop the seller from repeating... I would say there may be a case that Ebay acted negligently in protecting it's members from being scammed!

I didn't get any of his details, He offered to scan and send his driver's license and password etc. I requested them many times via email and when he called me, but he never sent them.

Anyways, contact me offline if I can help.

Best of luck

-R

Totti
21st November 2008, 07:01 PM
Good luck che5390, can only hope it pans out well for you. As for meeting in person, this may be preferable, but if you ever have to do it, just meet them somewhere public such as a bank where the ATM's are, as they are heavily video taped.

banjo
21st November 2008, 07:06 PM
If I was selling an expensive item on ebay, and some guy asked me if he could come around, look at it, and then pay cash, I would Back The Hell Away.

Potentially bad, sure. But much less likely than being scammed. Everything I've bought off eBay I made sure was in the same city and checked with the seller before bidding to ask if they would pick-up, cash in hand. One was a surfboard, another a fridge (both too large for post anyway), two were Mac Minis, and one iBook. All transactions went fine.

If the seller was in the same city and didn't want to allow that personal touch, then there would have been no deal. Being scammed in this way is even less likely than somebody standing behind you at an ATM just to mug you. Scams by remote via bank deposit are far, far more likely because you never know what sort of person you're talking to. In person at least you have an idea, and a face, and an actual address where they're likely to really be living.

schmidty
23rd November 2008, 01:02 AM
If I was selling an expensive item on ebay, and some guy asked me if he could come around, look at it, and then pay cash, I would Back The Hell Away.

Being scammed on ebay sounds a lot less foolish than "I let this guy into my place to look at my macbook pro, he punched me in the head and then took the computer".

For starters, I tend to make my enquiries before I bid. I have, so far, not gone to someone's house to check out an item before winning it. I just wouldn't bid on it if I had to transfer money to someone before I have the item in my hand.

In the cases of my guitars, local pick-up was the only option anyway, so at some stage I was going to go to the sellers' houses anyway (or, as in the second case, meet in a neutral location). Similarly, most of the items I sold by local pick-up were bulky (e.g., a 6 foot aquarium).

I don't think the risk of a buyer bashing you or stealing from you when s/he comes to your house is much greater than a tradesperson doing the same. You just have to trust people to some degree. I'd be more inclined to trust someone I see in person (and to trust money that I see in person -- anything other than cash isn't actually money; it's merely a debt) than someone who's a faceless email account. (Also, I'm big enough and strong enough that unless the person pulls a weapon, I (at least give off the impression that I) can handle myself.)

I've bought and sold several items in this manner, and never had any problems. The only problem I've had on eBay was a t-shirt I ordered from the US earlier this year that never arrived. The seller claimed mail loss, and I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, since I couldn't prove otherwise, and he had feedback in the thousands with > 99.9% positive. That was a loss of about $25, so no biggie.

The in-person folks were always very easy to deal with. I think, like me, they were glad to be dealing face-to-face with an actual person.

kaisersozay
23rd November 2008, 05:33 AM
I have said this before and I will say it again... ESCROW
Even suggest you will pay the Escrow fee.
I have watched numerous scammers either say no or simply never respond to the offer.
Consequently they are fraudsters. Why should anyone refuse this method? Obviously you would only use it if you consider the purchase to be a large expense for you the buyer.
Once the seller balks at Escrow. Drop the entire communication. You are out and your money remains with you. Not every sale is potentially an easy pick up and pay COD.
I'm not criticising the original poster, it takes some courage to fess up an error. Still, it points out that many of us are greedy and in an effort to get that great deal (too good to be true) do dumb things.
As an aside. I am staggered by this offer of copies of bank statements, passport, credit card etc.
No-one in their right mind would provide this stuff to a potential buyer, let alone your own family members. Doesn't pass the sniff test.

DeanCorp
23rd November 2008, 07:11 AM
I have said this before and I will say it again... ESCROW
Even suggest you will pay the Escrow fee.
I have watched numerous scammers either say no or simply never respond to the offer.
Consequently they are fraudsters. Why should anyone refuse this method? Obviously you would only use it if you consider the purchase to be a large expense for you the buyer.
Once the seller balks at Escrow. Drop the entire communication. You are out and your money remains with you. Not every sale is potentially an easy pick up and pay COD.
I'm not criticising the original poster, it takes some courage to fess up an error. Still, it points out that many of us are greedy and in an effort to get that great deal (too good to be true) do dumb things.
As an aside. I am staggered by this offer of copies of bank statements, passport, credit card etc.
No-one in their right mind would provide this stuff to a potential buyer, let alone your own family members. Doesn't pass the sniff test.

Escrow always makes me think of this story: The Powerbook Prank: He wanted a Powerbook. We gave him a P-P-P-Powerbook! (http://www.zug.com/pranks/powerbook/)

If you haven't read it. Please do!

dche5390, try do something similar to this ;)

lazydesi
23rd November 2008, 07:42 AM
Escrow always makes me think of this story: The Powerbook Prank: He wanted a Powerbook. We gave him a P-P-P-Powerbook! (http://www.zug.com/pranks/powerbook/)

If you haven't read it. Please do!

dche5390, try do something similar to this ;)

just read the story, it was awesome

lazydesi
23rd November 2008, 07:55 AM
hi friends,

my roommate was also scammed recently, he lost $450.

He was looking to buy 17inch macbook pro on ebay and contacted by username
Barry Hetharia
28 Kingsway,
London WC2B 6JR
United Kingdom

even he sends some pictures of macbook pro and serial too and we believe he was legitimate,



then he asked to forward the funds through western union and we know it was against the ebay policy and I asked my mate not to go forward with this transaction as it seems dodgy.

one fine day my mate came up with the news , he was contacted by the seller and asked him to pay half the price now and half after receiving the product. I told my mate not to proceed.

but he proceed with that transaction and lost the money as the MBP never show up.

kaisersozay
23rd November 2008, 08:13 AM
I have said this before and I will say it again... ESCROW
Once the seller balks at Escrow. Drop the entire communication. You are out and your money remains with you..

Very amusing link, though why the hell anyone would pursue such a ludicrous buyer at all, defies commonsense. I guess it was fun.
I was not suggesting a crap Escrow service, you can get legitimate Escrow through eBay, an Australian Escrow service.
https://www.escrow.com/index.asp
If the b uyer (or seller) won't accept your choice.. Deal over.
and if you can fork out for an item but won't factor in an Escrow cost, then you cannot be protected from yourself.

drzeus
23rd November 2008, 08:18 AM
I don't think the risk of a buyer bashing you or stealing from you when s/he comes to your house is much greater than a tradesperson doing the same. You just have to trust people to some degree. I'd be more inclined to trust someone I see in person (and to trust money that I see in person -- anything other than cash isn't actually money; it's merely a debt) than someone who's a faceless email account. (Also, I'm big enough and strong enough that unless the person pulls a weapon, I (at least give off the impression that I) can handle myself.)

The in-person folks were always very easy to deal with. I think, like me, they were glad to be dealing face-to-face with an actual person.

I agree. Buying face to face is infinitely safer than being scammed on ebay. Most scammers would never dare get into a face to face confrontation whereas scamming online feels to them as a victimless crime. They never see your face and feel the anonymity is a good escape, much of the reason people say things in emails that they would never say to someone's face.

The really sad thing is that these scammers get away with it time and time again and turn it into a profession. For them to receive the funds into a Bank account means the bank WILL have their true identity (very difficult to open an acccount without it). Unfortunately the Police often seems totally unhelpful in following the bank account evidence and tracking them down. Despite dozens of similar stories I've only known of one person who successfully pursuaded the police to follow it up...and that took a lot of effort and calls from his part.

To the Thread creator....I hope you get some of your money back or at least track the bastard down. We really need to pursue these scammers with all our power...

dche5390
23rd November 2008, 10:55 AM
I'm patiently waiting so that I may lodge my dispute with eBay then subsequently with the police. Getting together all the supporting documentation for the frauds claim.

I have quite a lot of information from another eBayer which I wont list here nor pass to the police just yet as I'm not sure of how the information was obtained. I will say though that I have a photo of the perp's New Zealand passport clearly stating his name and passport # as well as a CBA bankcard. I also have a scanned copy of the perp's bank statement. Allegedly, this information was emailed to a previous ebayer (who claims to have been scammed as well).

Either the scammer is totally dumbcase (who lives only 20 minutes drive from me) or this is a very elaborate setup with fake identities etc. Knowing its christmas season, and the number of more "important" cases that the police will have to deal with, I'm not holding my breathe for my case to be resolved. But I do have high hopes.

If the police don't end up doing their job, I have friends within CBA and Telstra who have offered me their help. I don't wish to endanger their careers and pending lawsuits just yet so I will wait before going on a personal vigilante witch hunt :D

Wishing I had never been overcome with greed as $1,300 would have covered the 3 suits I purchased this morning!

DeKa
23rd November 2008, 11:33 AM
I have been contacted by another ebay member who had been scammed the day before. I gave her a call and she indicated that she had a copy of his passport, mastercard, and bank statement. It appears she would have much more concrete evidence for tracking this guy down.

I wonder if this is related to this "Paypal" scam I got in my spam folder the other day? It appears to be asking people for information which reflects what your "eBay member" claims to have. It reads like this:


Dear Mr DeKa ,

PayPal Resolution Center: Your account is limited.

(Your case ID for this reason is PP-XXXXXX.) PayPal is constantly working to ensure security by regularly screening the accounts in our
system. We recently reviewed your account, and we need more information to help us provide you with secure service. Until we can collect
this information, your access to sensitive account features will be limited. We would like to restore your access as soon as possible, and
we apologize for the inconvenience.

This is done for your protection only you, the recipient of this email can take the next step in the remove limitation process.

Why is my account access limited?

November 15, 2008: We have reason to believe that your account was accessed by a third party. Because protecting the security of your
account is our primary concern, we have limited access to sensitive PayPal account features. We understand that this may be an inconvenience
but please understand that this temporary limitation is for your protection.

(Your case ID for this reason is PP-XXXXXX.)

How can I restore my account access?

In order to assist us with this security measure, we ask that you send us a photocopy or scan of one document from each of the two
categories listed below and return them via email to security@paypalfraudcheck.com :

1) Personal identification - a copy of one photographic ID from the following list:
- Passport - Driving license - National Identification card
- Citizenship certificate

2) Address verification - a copy of one of the following (online statements not accepted):
- Utility bill - less than 3 months old
- Tax bill - Bank statement - less than 3 months old

Completing all of the checklist items will automatically restore your account access.

Thank you for using PayPal!
The PayPal an eBay Company

-------------------------------------

Please do not reply to this email. This mailbox is not monitored and you will not receive a response. For assistance, log in to your PayPal
account and click the Help link located in the top right corner of any PayPal page.

PayPal Email ID PP-XXXXXX.


Why the hell anyone would respond to that is beyond me, but I'm sure some people would. What a way to get fake ID! The social engineering (and English language skills) of the scammers are getting better that's for sure.

Good luck dche.

kaisersozay
23rd November 2008, 11:46 AM
Right on DeKa!
The ID presented to the OP is more than likely some other poor sap.
Why would you accept or assume it belongs to the scammer? Looks like another hook is being baited.

vietnow
24th November 2008, 03:23 PM
The Powerbook Prank: He wanted a Powerbook. We gave him a P-P-P-Powerbook! (http://www.zug.com/pranks/powerbook/)

funniest thing i have read in ages. really.

Cassy
24th November 2008, 03:37 PM
Deka: I got the same email from Paypal years and years ago and I assumed it was legit because my Paypal account was actually locked. I never sent in any personal information so I never got access to my Paypal back- everytime I logged in, it would say I needed to verify my details and linked to something similar to that email but i vaguely remember a fax number listed that you had to fax the information to.

At the same time, Paypal specifically states that they will never ask for any personal info to be sent to them as soon as you log in.

moldor
25th November 2008, 07:43 PM
Hi everyone,

Thought I'd share my experience and open myself to a lot of snide remarks but I think its better for the general public to know of what avenues are available should they make the mistake of getting scammed by someone on eBay. I've learnt in life that its ok to admit to mistakes and I hope this may provide help to anyone else in a similar unfortunately circumstance (you're not alone). Despite having used eBay for many years now as buyer and seller, errors in judgement do occur.



I had a similar event, having used eBay for some 5 years without a hitch... here's what happened;

My wife wanted a particular phone and I refused to pay the exhorbitant prices they were asking for them, so I had a look around eBay and found one that looked promising - good condition, right price...

I won the auction and direct deposited the money... received the phone a few days later - just the phone, nothing else. No power supply, sync cable, etc. So I contacted him again and he said "Oh, I've lost all of those, but you can buy them quite cheaply". Alarm bells started to sound..

After charging the phone with a loaned charger, I found it was locked with a PIN - contacted the seller again and he denied all knowledge of the PIN, and then says "It actually was my flatmate <name> that was selling it - he just used my eBay account". He gives me flatmate's name and tells me he's working in the mines at <someplace in WA>, and offers to get in contact with him. Alarm bells move up a notch.

After a couple of days I've had enough - I contact him and tell him unless I get my money back in the next 7 days I'll go to the Police for fraud - he then says "Oh, all right. I'll put your money back in your account tomorrow. Don't bother sending the phone back, just throw it away".

WTF ?? These were selling at the time for something like $800 new... Alarm bells are now at DEFCON 1 !!!

So here I am out of pocket $250, with a phone that was PIN locked. Yeah, I could have gone to Sony Ericsson and told them the story and paid $50 to have it unlocked, but something struck me as bloody strange.

I remember seeing a sticker on the battery with a 7 digit hand-written number - looked rather strange, so I stripped the phone and found the same number inside the battery compartment. Having had a few never-to-be-sufficiently-damned Nokia phones repaired, I guessed that these were probably the stickers that repair centres place on the vaious parts so they are matched up in the service centre. Sony Ericsson confirmed this and pointed me to their two authorised service centres in WA.

First call struck paydirt - they confirmed that the phone had been in their service department a few months before for a speaker replacement. They put me in touch with the dealer who accepted it for repair, who told me that the young lady (!!!) who owned the phone had reported it stolen a few weeks before. They got in touch with her and gave her my details.

Ah ha !!!

The young lady calls me and we discuss the return of her phone, which she was still paying off. Turns out it was pinched from her flat at her 21st. Also turns out the guy I bought it from was her best friend's boyfriend, who she hated.

Here's where I, an ex-Lawyer and reasonable actor, starts to have some fun...:-)

I called the seller and said "Look, I've found out that the phone is stolen - that you stole it from <young lady> at her 21st. I personally don't give a flying fsck, but I want my money back". He agrees to put the money back in my account the next day, and thanks me profusely for not calling the cops.

Three days later, no money. I knew the area he lived in, but not his actual address, so I started calling around to all the people with the same surname in his area. I hit paydirt, sort of, on the third call - not him, but his parents house. I spoke to his sister and told her what had happened, and asked for his contact details. She wouldn't give them but offered to contact him for me.

During the conversation, she let it slip that her Father worked for <big bank>, one of their regional "directors". So I called his office and left a message that "your son sold me a stolen mobile phone, and had the money deposited into a <big bank> account - I wonder how the bank would like to know about that ?" - hey, the name of the game is bluffing, right ?

So he looks into it, phones me back apologetically and says the money will be in my account the next day, which it is (usually takes 36 hours, but when you're "the boss"...:-)). I tell him I will post the phone back and get the son's address.

Meanwhile, being the sneaky bastard that I am, I had been in touch with the local Constabulory in WA, who were very interested in the whole event and in my meticulous documentation of all of it. I pass it all on to a very helpful officer in WA, and post the phone back to him - he then returns it to <young lady> when he interviews her.

Couple of weeks later I get an email from said Officer to the effect that <ebay seller> admitted to everything, was fined $2000 and given a 12 month suspended sentence for handling stolen goods, theft and "attempting to obtain financial advantage by deception", <young lady> has her phone back and all is well with the world. She calls me and we meet for drinks when she is in Sydney for a holiday (damn cute too - pity I'm married - oh well...:-))

I admit that this is possibly all too rare an outcome for these "scams", but a few lessons are learned here;

1. Check the feedback. I personally will not buy from anyone with a 0 feedback, or with less than a 95% positive rating - of course, if you have feedback in the 30,000 range and 90% positive, I'll investigate the negatives before making a decision.

2. DOCUMENT EVERYTHING - you have a bloody computer / iPhone - use them !! Names, dates, times, copies of email, etc. Essential !!!

3. If a deal sounds too good to be true IT IS <probably> - there are exceptions, but very rare

4. The most important thing - TRUST YOUR GUT INSTINCT.

And, of course, don't be screwed by Ebay's "dispute" policy - if you've been scammed, and have it all documented, go directly to the Police themselves and DEMAND that their fraud squad does something about it - especially if your losses are high (like $1300 !!!)

vietnow
25th November 2008, 08:37 PM
bwaaahahaha pure gold.

i love to hear of scammers getting their just deserves. make me so happy, never been scammed myself but i am always on the look out.

forno
26th November 2008, 07:45 AM
We had a door knocker the other night getting donations for Heart Desease Australia.

He was polite and well presented but still that little bit too pushy like asking what charities we give to when he was told we dont wich to donate as we have other charities we give to.

Anyway after a long convo he said "there is another way you can help, If you show me your drivers licence I will show you how.

Suffice to say he was sent packing and we called the local cop shop, no more than 3 minutes away by car, they said "That does sound strange, we will go and have a chat and let you know either way"

No call so who knows if this guy scammed someone less aware

DeKa
27th November 2008, 08:50 PM
moldor,
Love that story!

EdgeOfQuarrel
28th November 2008, 09:43 PM
I sold a computer on ebay once.

Ok this jerkoff pays on a thursday via paypal by echeck.(minimum 5 days to clear)

The zipperhead put's in a did not recieve thing.(paid for express)

Now I send it express post when the check clears.(thursday lunchtime)

Buyer posts neg feedback on thursday night BEFORE he even has it!

Saturday morning 6am I get an irate phonecall asking why I took so long to mail he's computer (?)

Politely inform him it was sent express the day he's check cleared so what else did he expect?

Laughs and says he's keeping the computer AND getting a refund.

Later that day I get irate emails saying it wasn't as how i described it (about HD size .. listed as 160 actual about 149 or something)

So that's twice he's acknowledged he's acually recieved it.

Doesn't close the paypal dispute till about 2 minutes before it closes automatically he upgrades it saying he still hasn't recieved anything!

According to paypal merely using the express number you get to them ISN'T PROOF because "they only accept online tracking"

So ... I take a 3 hour drive.I get my computer back after I watched him log on to paypal and close it while I'm standing over he's shoulder watching him type on MY old computer :)

Which then became mine again. :D

And I gave him a cheque .... minus all fee's,phone calls,petrol money,damages and a bit extra to teach him a lesson.

Sellers aren't the only scammers on ebay!

I'm by no means a business I just sell some stuff from around the house.Big business and corporations have ruined ebay basically.

Ralph Warner
1st December 2008, 08:52 PM
These scams are much more common than you may think,


To the OP, your case was bought to my attention by a member of a scambaiting site who asked me to look into it for you.

The scammer may not have given up on you yet, he may contact you and tell you that a simple tax needs to be paid before you can get the goods, you should also be aware of recovery scams, this is where you may be contacted by somebody who says they can help to get your money back, the catch is that there will be fees involved, fees that will end up in the same hands as the first money you sent.

Scammers steal money from internet users as a living, armed with an internet cafe computer and a few prewritten scripts they are able to steal many thousands of dollars and remain virtually untouchable so how do they do it

We all know that to get a bank account you need to have appropriate identification
We know that when you buy your mobile phone number it is registered so it is not anonymous
We know that ebay requires checks to be done before letting you join
We know how secure Paypal is
We know that when we see a persons ID that it is indeed them

Right

Wrong
Scammers are able to convince people to set up bank accounts on their behalf with the lure of large amounts of money being put into it
It is quite possible (and very easy) to buy a sim card using cash, register fake details and buy credits with cash
Ebay does do extensive checks on people but unfortunately the criminals are one step ahead of them (this thread is proof of that)
Scammers can and do use Paypal to scam as well, using their bank account they set up paypal, by the time anybody realises they have been scammed the money is withdrawn and the account is abandoned
Scam victims often provide their real identification and their bank details, this information is then used to scam people, the scammer hacks into the bank account and takes over control, he can recieve and dispurse funds from it as if it were his own, depending on how astute the real owner is this account may be in the scammers possession for months, meanwhile he creates an email address and name lining up with the stolen ID.

Scammers are very clever and can get around all kinds of hurdles that are put in front of them, the best way to stop scams is to promote awareness, in this case the main scammers may not even living in Australia

The site rules say that I am not to include links or promotion of other sites so what I will say is that using google, you will find the answers to most scam related questions.

You could google the following to find information

To person you are not sure about's;
name
email address
phone number
emails, (pick out a small section, preferably wit ha spelling or grammar mistake) and search on it
Their address
any shipping company they suggest (or any other person they introduce you to for that matter)
Use tineye (a free website tool that searches for pictures)

You can also get further advice by searching on,
My username
419scam
ebay scam
cheque scam
scambaiting
scamwarner
Recovery scam

Lastly, I am a volunteer at a scam victim support website, we do not ask or expect money from you, dont pay money to anybody for such a service, many people will do it for free, they do like thank yous after helping you but ;)



Before I forget dche5390, if you still want to get in touch with me you will work out how ;)