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kim jong il
16th April 2004, 05:13 PM
I'm up to archiving data and thought to upgrade to toast titanium 6. It is an ABSOLUTE DOG. There is NOTHING good I could say about this piece of crap.

Sorry, there is........

If you need something to choke up system resources or know someone you just plain don't like. Toast 6 would be the ideal gift idea

I have nothing good to say about this (pre) beta release.. How are you supposed to use software that crashes before it is barely moving. The software crashes (but only when you want it to do something), the mac crashes (finder freeze). CD RW are unrecognizable if corrupt (how the hell are you supposed to erase them?) 2 out of three burns fails due to being unverifiable and then crashes the computer for good measure (interestingly CD,s that crash OS 10 are mountable/readable CD's under OS 9). And to top it off, burning at half 'reccommended' speed is an option that is not reccommended. It will, by contrast, quite happily, burn (unverifiable data) at speeds higher than the drive will support.

Resorted to OS 9 (bootup) and toast 5, absolutely beautiful, but then the files are hard to find and organise from the OS X partition.

It should be all easy, but it isn't

cheers, kim

Disko
16th April 2004, 05:21 PM
I've had no problems with it at all. I think it's great. :)

What hardware are you using? Have you tried reinstalling, resetting PRam, repairing permissions?

kim jong il
16th April 2004, 05:30 PM
This is a strange one. I had a friend who had similar issues but his experience also was that NO ONE else had these issues. (him G4 DP 1.25? GHz), me G3 400 imac) (He is on holiday and unavailable for consultation). A firewire issue perhaps? (for me that is). No idea.

EDIT:G4 DP 867

It works a bit, this is the confiusing part.

Therefore, I will do what is suggested (by disko) and report back

cheers, kim

pipsqeek
16th April 2004, 05:45 PM
I've had no issues.

Toast 6 Titanium
900MHz G3 iBook
384MB RAM
OSX 10.3.3

Steve

Currawong
16th April 2004, 06:58 PM
No issues here either. Does it not burn when no other apps are running? Playing music in iTunes would give me DVD coasters on my DP450...

kim jong il
16th April 2004, 07:41 PM
OK, knowing absolutely nothing about repairing permissions I went and did some minor research and came up with this (below) from here (http://www.macfixitforums.com/php/showflat.php?Board=xutilities&Number=569332). This seems to be an informative thread but raises a few questions as well as answering a few.

QUOTE:

You might also want to explain that while the permissions are stored in the disk directory, errors in them are not recognized by disk repair utilities. Some incorrect permissions are caused by poorly-written third-party installers that modify permissions and do not set them back to their original values. In the worst case, incorrect permissions can cause a volume to fail to mount. (Postings about such cases have not mentioned whether the Mount command in Disk Utility was used to mount the volume first.) If that happens, boot from the Mac OS X Installer CD, repair permissions by opening Disk Utility in the Installer menu, then restart from the hard drive, and repair permissions again using the copy of Disk Utility on the hard drive (unless the versions of Mac OS X on the Installer CD and the hard drive are identical, which means that your CD is less than two weeks old, or you lack the courage to upgrade to a later version).

Finally, for would-be power users, I have seen no reports of anyone succeeding in repairing permissions in single-user mode.

MicroMat Inc
Makers of TechTool

UNQUOTE

I do believe that there is something in this thread for OS X newbies (less than 12 months) like myself. If nothing else it is informative although the final sentence bothers me. It is clear enough, I just completely fail to understand what it means. My other machine (EDIT: the one with the problem, not this one) has found damaged permissions regarding cd9660 access and claims to have repaired this. However, this thread suggests that the computer and 10.3.3 are just telling me this without actually doing anything.

UPDATE: Humbug to some of the above, it all works now. The CD RW recognises rewriteables, all partitions mount, the air is purer and somwhere a small bird is singing.

Thanks for steering me in the right direction to those who bothered.

cheers, kim

Atomic
16th April 2004, 07:53 PM
You can always try Dragon Burn (http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/19061) as a comparison - free trial too.

kim jong il
16th April 2004, 08:13 PM
Sorry, just a bit of extra info.

Firstly I am amazed that this one little thing (permissions) could create so many, seemingly, unrelated problems (crashes, unmountable unrelated partitions) Maybe I should have realised that if it (albeit an earlier version) was performing flawlessly under OS 9 that something was amiss other than the application in question. I am surprised that an installer from such a well known (and respected) company produced such unexpected results. (the post from the macfixit forums suggest that this is the result of a crappily written installer script)

I cannot test yet whether unverifiable disks crash the machine as I cannot (EDIT: have not yet) produce one now (I'm working on it!). So far (as tested by me) the CD drive supports (verifiable) re-write speeds 50% higher than its rated capacity. (BTW CD RW is Que!fire 32X8X4)

cheers, kim

cmetom
20th April 2004, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by kim jong il@Apr 16 2004, 06:13 PM
I have nothing good to say about this (pre) beta release..
that'd be an alpha release, wouldn't it?? :huh:

kim jong il
21st April 2004, 09:48 AM
Hi cmetom, that would indeed make it an alpha release. I was playing it safe with language. Alpha releases, as I believe (and I've been wrong quite a bit in the last couple of weeks) are released to, relatively few beta testers. Is this correct? I should add here, that usually, when I ask questions here it really does mean that I am absolutely clueless.

Sometimes asking a question and reading input from a variety of sources often gives me a really good starting point for research or sometimes, simply, the absolutely definitive solution. As was the case here. :) It was suggested by a couple of respondants that I repair the permissions. At the time it was: "What the hell are these people talking about?" It did, however, give me a starting point; I went away; did some quick research (permissions? how obvious it seems now) and now it works flawlessly.

Possibly I should post a link to another forum that is developing a sticky FAQ that deals exclusively with this issue and related problems/symptoms.

(if AppleTalkAustralia admins or anyone else expresses interest, I will post or PM the link to the interested parties)

I have yet to encounter an application installer that says "Congratulations on your purchase. This installer changes permissions during installation and will not restore them correctly rendering the application inoperative and you confused and frustrated. Please restart and boot up using the OS X installer CD#1. Run 'disk utility' from this CD to repair the damage done by our installer. Enjoy"

NOTE: CORRECTION to above kim jong il post. The drive is actually a Que!fire 32X12X10 (I bought it second hand; just a bare drive without docco's). It is still happy to re-write at 12X which is only 15% higher than its rated maximum re-write speed (verified burns on pre erased re writeables). It is doing this now with absolute reliability. The media being used is nothing flash. Just TDK 4~10X CD-RW.

cheers, kim

stickman67
21st April 2004, 10:52 AM
When OS X 10.3 first came out, I waited for quite a while to buy it, and only came in at 10.3.2.

From the outset I had massive problems with kernel panics, even on the 10.3 install CD!

But I finally managed to install it, and to update it to 10.3.2.

Great, but anything up to 12 kernel panics a day, increasing in frequency as I had more panics. (In other words, the more panics I had, the faster they came.)

I still don't know what caused the problem, but I do know that the only thing that kept me going was repairing the permissions and deleting caches every time the panics became to close together for me to work (semi)effectively.

And now, on 10.3.3, I haven't had a panic for weeks. :rolleyes:

But it did teach me the value of repairing permissions periodically. It's now part of my ongoing maintenance routine. (Deleting caches is only something I do when I really get a problem, and simply doing this without also repairing permissions did not help when things were really rough.)

Utilities like Panther Cache Cleaner, Cocktail and Onyx, among others, will do all of this and more for you.

It's amazing how the little things do such big things! :lol:

pipsqeek
21st April 2004, 07:27 PM
I, fortunately have not had any of these issues that have been mentioned.

Unfortunately, because of it, I also do not understand what it all means.

I would like to know as I am usually a leech for information. And when it does happen to me I'll roughly know what to do.

Steve

stickman67
22nd April 2004, 08:12 AM
I can't tell you exactly why repairing permissions seems to "fix" things that are "broken", but it works, and it's a job I now do (like yesterday, after this thread had reminded me to do it) quite regularly, whether the 'puter seems to need it or not.

It's also a great idea (or so I'm told) to repair permissions before and after installing any software, particularly system software.

There's a great page on fixing problems at Mac OS X Hints. Following is the short list (basically the subheadings):


20 Troubleshooting Steps for OS X

So your OS X Mac isn't working quite right. What should you do? Here's a list of 20 basic steps to try.

FIRST AID
01 Restart
02 Check/fix the filesystem
03 Make sure you're not running out of free space on the System volume
04 Repair permissions
05 Create a new user account, and see if the problem persists there
06 Clear system & user caches
07 Disable Application Enhancer, if you're running it
08 Startup in SafeBoot mode, and see if the problem persists there
09 Reset system firmware
10 Unplug all USB, Firewire devices except Apple mouse

MORE SERIOUS TROUBLESHOOTING
11 Reapply the latest combo updater
12 Run the Apple hardware diagnostic CD
13 Check the hard drive for bad blocks
14 Take out 3rd party RAM
15 Unplug 3rd Party PCI cards
16 Reset PMU
17 Archive and reinstall the OS
18 Reinstall the system from scratch
19 Send the machine back to Apple
20 Additional Notes

The page also has explanations for each of these (some more in-depth than others) and a discussion by people who've read this, with some extra tips and information.

It can be found here: 20 Troubleshooting Steps for OS X (http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=2004011205473937).

Enjoy! :D

pipsqeek
22nd April 2004, 08:59 AM
Big help! Thanx!

Its been bookmarked

Steve